Songwriters vs Lyricists
I have seen both used interchangeably and I've seen people say that lyricist only write 'some' words in a song but a songwriter, writes the entire song and composes it.
What say you? What is your definition of a songwriter and lyricist?
Comments
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Good question, I don't get hung up on labels, but if pushed I would prefer lyricist, if only to avoid arguing with some elitist singer/songwriter.
If you take the word songwriter it is clearly composed of two words- song and writer.
Song is defined, and generally accepted, as a composition that is sung with or without musical accompaniment.
Writer, the person who writes the lyrics.
Therefore it follows, anyone who writes lyrics and sings it to themselves falls under the definition of songwriter.
Go figure!
Sid
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songwriter /sông′rī″tər, sŏng′-/
noun
- One who writes lyrics or tunes, or both, for songs.
- Someone who writes the lyrics and usually the music of songs.
- A composer of words or music for popular songs.
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, 5th Edition • More at Wordnik
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Sid
Here endeth my involvement in the thread, better things to do.
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I apologize I never should've published the dictionary post. I never for a moment thought it would elicit such a derogatory remark. I wonder why the moderator, RDM, hasn't said anything about the "up his ass" comment. I can't help but wonder if RDM and the commentator are the same people?
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@sidshovel @StoneFlowers Neither of you shine any credit on yourselves here.
Remember that it is a requirement of the forum that you show respect to other members. Should similar behaviour continue, there will be consequences in the form of temporary bans.
As to why I didn't comment on this earlier, I live in Australia, check the time zones. To say that I masquerade as Sid is nonsense and an insult to him.
What a trivial topic to get incensed over.
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Well either term as long as you get a song out of it. I personally know a lyricist that gets checks in the mail every month , He collaborates with track guys . I'm sure AI will be more involved with music per Rick Beato
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It's almost funny that someone can find something to be offended about over something as unimportant as this. I've changed my mind. It's not just "almost" hilarious.
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its just a song Suno or not , its entertainment . Nobody on forums have a multi million deals with Sony
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I don't know why I classify songwriters as people like Maurice White (Earth, Wind, and Fire)
And lyricists like Kendrick Lamar. He's a genius when it comes to lyrics.
I'm learning.
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Thanks everyone for your comments.
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2025 songs might have 10 writers on them
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Can't get my head around multiple songwriters, I find writing songs so personal that it's hard to imagine someone else being on the same wavelength to effectively contribute.
I get Lennon and McCartney, Holland-Dozier-Holland, the Gibbs Bros, the concept of staff writers working on a song to me is akin to a Chinese shoe factory.
Strangely odd!
Sid
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Don't know really , New business I guess . Trends change all the time
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I don’t think there personal songs
More on level on hits of 2025
Hooky verses hooky chorus's
Musically and lyrically
That’s just a guess . Most radio songs are upbeat love songs .0 -
all grist to mill, I suppose
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Are they all working on the song together at the same time to crank it out faster?
Or is it more like with screenwriting where there's usually multiple writers across several drafts, including ghost-writers & script-doctors being brought in to make it more commercial?
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While respecting the dictionary definitions, to me, and probably to most people, a songwriter is someone whose creative process results in a finished song - music and lyrics - whereas a lyricist is someone who "just" writes lyrics. I put the quotation marks around the word "just," because great lyricists deserve respect for writing those great lyrics and are often part of a team - Rogers and Hammerstein, Elton John and Bernie Taupin - and together these partners are songwriters.
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I honestly think that writing satisfying lyrics is the hardest part of writing a song. The lyrics are what make a great song standout from everything else, and since the possibilities of word choices are almost endless, there are much more difficult choices that need to be made than with the melody.
Once you know the lyrics and the chords you are using for a standard pop, rock, country song the melody choices are much more restricted.
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Have you listened to the lyrics of most pop songs over the last few decades? 🙄It’s like they don’t matter. But I take your point. To those of us who care, the lyric is an equal partner with the melody. I almost always write the melody before any consideration of the chords that underlie them, so the choices are not limited. It all depends on your approach to songwriting. Many (by no means all) lyricists regard a melody as just a way to get their lyrics out there. To me, the melody often comes first or at the same time as the words. Everyone has their own way of writing a song 🙂0
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I have, and I think there are very clever pop songs out there, but they aren’t always the most popular ones at the top of the charts. I think there can be between 10-20 excellent pop songs released every year. Depends on the extent of what you count as pop I guess.
But I agree that the melody does often come first, but it’s usually the lyrics that lift the song from a good song to a great song. They add the intangible thing that makes the song standout from every other song in that same key and chord progression. But lyrics aren’t just the words, but also the rhythm of how the syllables express the melody.
And if the piece of music doesn’t have lyrics, it is usually expressing a greater amount of emotion through the melody than the instruments could do in a song, where the singer is usually featured.
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All good points, especially regarding the quality of words. Too many lyricists ignore the possibilities of sound and think only in terms of meaning. Rhyme, internal rhyme, alliteration, assonance - so much fun to be had for both the writer and the listener. Add to that the fact that some words and sounds are just fun to sing for some reason.🙂
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@TammyB Simple. Since both take part in writing songs they are both songwriters.
Renee 💌
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